Journey through The Dark Project: Part 2
So… Constantine hired Garrett to steal a sword from Constantine’s own mansion to prove that Garrett was the right person to steal The Eye from the abandoned Hammer Cathedral. Unfortunately, the Keepers sealed the Cathedral after an undead uprising. Now in order to gain access to the Cathedral and steal The Eye Garrett needs to recover the four elemental talismans from different locations around the City.
By including the Thieves Guild and the Hand Brotherhood, Thief Gold expands on the politics of the City, which serves to frame Garrett’s action within a broader context. It’s not so straightforward as the Hammers, Pagans, and Keepers.
“The Mage Towers”:
“The Mage Towers” next, another addition for Thief Gold I believe. Need to remember to take it a little slower and treat every room as a potential source of loot.
Garrett doing his best Homer Simpson impression.
So much objective text they had to shrink the font.
I swear these are the loudest doors in the entire fucking world.
I just mantled up onto a ramp, only to creep back down it again to a place around 10 meters ahead of where I started simply because going that way was darker. This game might be alright.
Immediately the handling of light sources in this level feels more in line with the rest of the game than it did in “Thieves’ Guild”. The lighting changed as I expected when I dowsed that torch.
In classic fashion I am doing this entirely level backward having now found the exit.
I want the Talisman of Earth so to the Earth Tower it is (I know it won’t be that simple but I’ve got to start somewhere). Get to the top of that tower from the outside and there’s a door that cannot even be frobbed, so that’s how it is huh? I tried shooting a Moss Arrow at it because Earth Tower and all that. Did nothing. It’s totally going to be a magic lock, and I’m going to have to visit all the Towers in some specific order or some shit.
You don’t know me creepy talking statue man, you don’t know me. I don’t have to listen to you… You’re not my real dad…
What followed was an eye-roll visible from space.
He just stood there like there for several seconds. Probably a bug, but I’m going to assume he enters a fugue state while the statues talk to him.
I’m < 600 off the loot goal and I haven’t even entered any of the towers yet. This is going a little better.
Again a nice in-context map, Garrett was able to “obtain” a layout of the common areas but nothing for the towers as they are restricted to the Hand Brotherhood itself.
This was a cool challenge. The door at the end is locked, and this area is patrolled by three guards. Needed to move into the light and pick the lock while listening out for the doors behind me opening which would signal a need to dart back into the shadows.
Optional objectives done, and nearly all the loot obtained. Helps that there was some indication of where to go to complete the secondary objectives. I also like that the objective loot pieces have a value that counts toward your total.
So Water Temple time… Tower… Water Tower time…
That was far far less complicated that I was expecting.
I am oddly partial to underwater levels, so I was a little disappointed in what the Water Tower actually turned out to be. I wonder if originally there was a more involved version but it never quite worked; same for the Air Tower.
The Earth Tower however is much more of a faff. Floating stone platforms seemed like a neat idea, then the area above just kept going and going.
The level is called “The Mage Towers” not “The Mages Tower” which makes more sense. Anyway, it’s a fussy level more than an annoying one. I’ve done all the optional objectives and have my routes between each tower sorted, I just need to complete them all now.
“Then everything changed when the Fire Tower attacked…”
Erm… Well, I guess you could do that, sure.
Of the four only the Air and Fire Towers have particularly good final rooms. Aside from that only the Fire Tower really has a consistent theme. The Air Tower is just a lot of open spaces and some floating platforms, and the Earth Tower has floating platforms too for some reason.
I assume finding the correct Earth Talisman has something to do with this, but I can’t work it out.
I assume finding the correct Earth Talisman has something to do with this, but I can’t work it out. Hand with sword… There’s no statues or anything up here so sword hand? So right hand? Turn away would be left. Count to the left seven… But do I start with the one I can see from the door? Or the first one to my left? It feels like it should be turn then count, but if I do that I get hit in the face. If I start counting with the one I can see and go left seven from there…. I get the right one. Hmm… Not sure that riddle really works given the layout of the room.
“The Mage Towers” done. That wasn’t so bad. Central area was a fairly standard urban style location, I think I got like 90% of the loot there. The Water Tower was much shorter than I expected, while the others were a little over-long.
The set up made me assumed I’d “have to” visit all of the Towers so that wasn’t really a surprise. I would have wanted to explore them all anyway. Once I realised what I’d need to do I scoped out a route between them all so I wouldn’t waste too much time. “The Mage Towers” was the eighth level meaning I’m now over half way through. So far “The Mage Towers” is the better of the two Thief Gold levels I’ve seen. “The Sword” and “Assassins” are tied for best level overall. “Thieves’ Guild” is the weakest so far, but despite my complaints at the time it’s far from terrible. The overall quality of the level design has been consistently high.
In terms of plot we are solidly in the Act 2 now, the quest is underway, obstacles are presenting themselves and being overcome. Things are challenging for our protagonist but nothing dramatically life changing has happened yet… I’m keeping an eye out though. ;)
“The Lost City”:
Making a start on “The Lost City”. I love that you start on the streets of the city and your first objective is to actually find the entrance. Though I doubt this first section will be very large it’s a good way of spatially contextualising what comes after.
This corner of the city was also in “Assassins”. And so the player might have already seen the ‘keyhole’ before. Which is a nice touch. – Andy Durdin
Here we go…
Uh oh… This could be a bad start.
Well there’s the Fire Talisman (Talisman of Fire?), I now just have to find a way to to reach it.
Here’s my problem with Burricks, they look like Barney the Dinosaur went on a bender.
I’ve played the version of this level from The Metal Age but I don’t remember it very well so everything has the weird half-familiar quality that I think fits it perfectly.
The map for “The Lost City” is great, and oddly I’m actually finding it fairly easy to navigate by. Most important thing is knowing where each area is relative to the others and for that it’s fine.
Automatic light crystals! That makes sneaking a little more complicated. Though as they are motion sensing they can also be used to determine which rooms are occupied; just wait outside until it goes dark again.
This is one of the single greatest aspects of Thief, the ability to use the environment not just to keep yourself concealed but also to track the movements of NPCs. Many is the time I’ve used a Moss Arrow on a section of corridor specifically so I can tell when an NPC reaches that point, due to the change in their footfalls. That’s a difference between The Metal Age and The Dark Project that I wasn’t expecting; I’m finding Moss Arrows much more important than Water Arrows. I feel like I can deal with my visibility well enough, trying to stay quiet in some of these levels has proven really challenging.
The journal entries of the Keepers who came down to the Lost City before me, they no doubt met an unpleasant end, and I shall find evidence of their progress as I make my own.
Right, so these are probably the real Fire Elementals. That thing in “Down in the Bonehoard” was something else entirely.
Not exactly the Bear Pits…
Another angle of the tower that holds the Fire Talisman. Common and effective architectural technique to present a series of different angles on the same landmark. Creates a sense of anticipation, while each fresh view reveals a new aspect of its construction.
Uh oh, I just remembered that the shop at the start of this mission didn’t have any Moss Arrows.
I had been worried about the loot objective, then I found a building at the bottom corner of the map that gave me 50% of what I needed in one go. And another… Every one of those blue stones is loot. Score!
I quite like “The Lost City”. Each area has a distinct feel and is clearly separated from the others by caves, meaning it’s actually harder to get lost than I expected.
It’s not quite the Thieves’ Highway, but it’ll do. The uniform shape of the buildings makes jumping and mantling between them frustration free.
You can purchase a commission from an acquaintance, doing so makes certain items found have value where normally they wouldn’t. Gervaisius? That name sounds familiar. Come The Metal Age his interest in Precursor Masks will come back to haunt everybody.
“Shh… Just stay looking that way, don’t turn around.” (Bonus creepy face!)
I couldn’t tell that beam was wood from the texture, but contextually it made sense that it would be something that’d allow me to reach the upper floor.
This actually makes some sense of the fish creatures in Thief: Deadly Shadows. Were the Kurshok and the Precursors friends? Maybe even the same species?
Uniform shaped buildings with sealed metal doors… This isn’t creepy at all. Either cells or tombs, not quite sure which.
Are these two supposed to be having a conversation? Nothing is triggering.
I got so excited I found the tower that I forgot to take a screenshot. Still I have found it, and the Fire Talisman is within sight… Sort of.
N’Lathotep? That name sounds a little too close to Nyarlathotep to entirely be a coincidence.
Well played. I walked up the stairs turned the corner, fell down and couldn’t work out what the fuck had happened. Oh… I’m going to have to climb out on those narrow ledges I saw earlier aren’t it?
<Ron Howard Voice> He was.
Ah ha! Two down, two more to go. Provided I can get out again.
Fire Elementals! Fire Elementals everywhere! I’ve used more Water Arrows on them than I have on torches so far this level.
The Lost City was buried in an earthquake/volcanic eruption, it’s not entirely clear. It’s all very Atlantis which isn’t surprising.
And done. “The Lost City” was good. Wish my first experience of “Down in the Bonehoard” hadn’t been so bad, as these weirder levels are cool. Still not the biggest fan of Burricks though; I also think I might be partially responsible for their near extinction.
I think “Down in the Bonehoard” is doing too many things at once for me, zombies, weird organic layout, traps, and environmental puzzles. It feels less focused on sneaking and comes too early to feel like an intentional format breaker. It’s not so much that I didn’t like being “Indiana Garrett”, but that it felt like every possible aspect of that was dropped on me at once before I was really comfortable with the game’s systems.
Not much new story wise. Garrett has two talismans left to recover and nothing to tell Constantine until he has them and has gained entry to the haunted cathedral.
“Song of the Caverns”:
The next level “Song of the Caverns” is the last of those added for Thief Gold, and I’ve heard good things about it.
Stunning revelation I know, but this game is pretty good.
Scuttling spiders in the briefing video for “Song of the Caverns”, lovely. Good thing I won’t have to deal with them. 200 loot? That seems like something that’s going to change.
Another wonderfully helpful map I see.
Not foreboding at all. My arachnophobia is spiking even though I know I’ve modded the spiders out.
Rocks dropping from the roof aren’t helping the general level of tension either.
I do NOT like the noise these things make.
I’m starting to understand why Garrett has a sword, because in The Metal Age it always seemed a little over the top.
Well this is bad…
… Then again. Turns out “Stand Not Against Us” was a little more literal than figurative.
Empty. Well it wasn’t ever going to be that easy was it?
“Let’s go see Raoul…” This level got weird, in an entirely different way than I was expecting.
Time to break into an opera house. Raoul gives you a map but unlike in “Assassins” it’s not added to your map screen instead you have to manually select it in your inventory if you want to look at it, nice touch. (Oh, it’s been added to the main map screen now. I’m a little disappointed.)
I knew that 200 loot requirement wouldn’t last… Things just got weird and complicated…
*Cough*Film Noir*Cough*
“Song of the Caverns” really feels like it could be a Dishonored level.
Unfortunately I’m noticing a bunch of the same lighting issues I had with “Thieves’ Guild”. There’s nothing behind or above me and the closest light source is around a ninety degree corner, yet I’m still illuminated.
Oh please let ‘B’ mean Bafford and that he planned to give the sceptre to Carmella.
I may have made a wrong turn.
And I just hit Quick Save instead of Quick Load… Fuck. Guess I’m restarting this mission…
Unexpected side effect of using the No Spiders mod is that some spaces feel eerily empty in a way that still fits the tone of the game. I might even be doing it to myself as I have no idea where the spiders should be. The three levels added for Thief Gold all have a scale that’s out of sync with the rest of the game. Rooms and corridors are generally larger even if the overall level is of a similar size.
These fucking Craymen are going to make me learn how to backstab. Hmm… You can’t pick up creature bodies, even when they are broadly humanoid in form. I guess that makes sense, does slightly complicate matters though. I suppose there’s always the good old “run away” tactic.
That Raoul knows about the Keepers suggests that either the populace at large are aware of them and don’t care (because it’s rarely brought up by anybody else) or that they believe them to have all died/disappeared years ago. Raoul becomes somewhat less endearing when you work out that the red crosses on his map are secret passages, including ones with peepholes into dressing rooms.
There’s this concept in architecture of served and servant spaces (distinct from public/private spaces). In short, served spaces are those designed for use and servant spaces are those necessary to support that use. The historically influenced fictional context of Thief (and Dishonored) allows those distinctions to become even more literal; there are actual servants. I think one of the biggest differentiators between good/bad stealth level design is their use of those two spaces. Servant spaces are utilitarian and in Thief that makes them “safer”: lights are old-fashioned (torches compared to electric lamps), surfaces are made from simple materials like wood or stone (no polished floors), and there’s limited NPC traffic. It’s not simply that one type of space is safe and one isn’t, the key difference is that the served spaces are are not just more “hostile” but that the range of threat they offer is more varied; there are polished marble floors and lush carpets, stark electric lights and pools or near total darkness. Servant spaces offer a relatively flat/consistent threat level, served spaces are more spiky, but the rewards are higher. Most of the loot you will want is in the served spaces, because of course it is. Servant spaces provide your traversal options.
One of the big factors in what makes the level design of Dishonored so smart (and an influence you can see from Thief), is that every shortcut to gain entry to a building will take you to a servant space. Turn into a fish to gain entry to The Golden Cat from the water, and you arrive in a downstairs toilet. Toilets are interesting edge cases, they are servant spaces but have to exist with a closer connection to served spaces and so can be ornamented as such. By removing or granting access to servant spaces level designers can change the relative safety of a given location in ways that don’t feel heavy handed. Amusingly, adding additional connections to servant spaces usually tends to feel like “clever design”. Discovering there’s a secret passage for servants between the master bedroom and the kitchen is more likely to make players think about the social/cultural implications of that connection than the way it’s balancing the threat level of the space. Also secret passages and creeping through servant spaces is just inherently appealing as it’s something we generally don’t get to do in our lives. It feels illicit and reinforces the sense that we are doing something unusual and special. I talked about this idea of a spatial divide based on utility nearly a decade ago (before I knew about the concept of served/servant spaces). It’s not quite a 1-to-1 but logical space is servant space and functional space is served space. The core idea still works: games that make heavy use of logical space feel richer, more organic. Those that rely on functional space feel purer, more abstract.
This is the core of the issue with the Thief reboot: its over reliance on purely functional space. The linearly directed nature of the levels means what servant spaces do exist provide the lone traversal route between two bubbles of action. Compare this to Dishonored 2, where each level is a dense interconnection of served and servant spaces. The Clockwork Mansion for example lets you traverse the whole level via one or the other, or move between them pretty much at will. This is also why I’m generally not a fan of streaming solutions for stealth games. The need to constrict player movement to allow the next section to load tends to make all servant spaces one-directional traversal zones. This disregard for the importance of servant spaces – and other low-interactivity areas – is what makes so many levels feel like sets rather than places. The respect for them is also why The Dark Project‘s level still seem “real” even on twenty year old technology. Hitman is another series that entirely gets the importance of this divide (and the public/private divide). Again the games in that series that didn’t (Hitman: Absolution) were the most poorly received. It’s not about whether levels are linear or non-linear, but rather how they use the space they have and whether they try to make it all “important” and functional. The real world is full of seemingly unimportant (in reality very important) spaces. An example of an essentially linear game that understood this is the original Mirror’s Edge. it helps that a lot of roof spaces are by their inherent inaccessibility de facto servant spaces.
I like how leaning means everything takes on a dutch angle.
I do love it when this game just gives you a room full of loot and no guards, like “Hey life is hard, have some shinies.”
Garrett: “Huh, do people really pay money to see this stuff?”
I’m thinking this Ian Cribs fellow might be a hack.
I mean it’s no “Lusty Argonian Maid” or “Daughter of Tyvia”
Haha… Alright fair play game, you fucking got me. I unlock the door to Cribs’ room and suddenly I hear somebody sing out “But wait – who is this I spy?” and I start to panic. Now Cribs and his leading lady are arguing…
“Untalented Taffer troglodyte.” Well she told him.
I guess we know how Cribs got the job then…
The book on the right can’t be frobbed, is that just how it is or a bug?
I love these kind of hallways, they let me play “the floor is lava” and leap between patches of carpet from one end to the other.
I just pickpocketed a lady’s jeweled opera glasses while she was in her private booth… I am the best thief!
Found the Water Talisman, still 500 shy of the loot goal, but there’s an entirely floor of this Opera House I haven’t visited yet.
Sometimes after I mantle up onto something (even while moving slowly) Garrett will jump at the top causing him to make noise. It’s inconsistent enough to be annoying.
And now guards can apparently see through banners that are still intact… Hmm…
Multiple times now I’ve opened a door and it has just disappeared, making it impossible to close again. This level is a bit buggy.
Something, something, treading the boards…
That’s “Song of the Caverns” done. The best of the additional levels easily, though it still felt a little rough compared to the rest of the game. Lighting was inconsistent and unclear, and there were several bugs I’d never encountered before.
I’m still having trouble finding all the loot necessary. I’m always around 50 short when I’m otherwise ready to leave. I don’t remember having this issue with The Metal Age.
I like the idea of the fake-out opening, though the two levels that have done it both had elements in their briefing/objectives that gave them away. In the end that doesn’t matter but a stronger commitment to the gag would have been nice. Aside from the starting area “Song of the Caverns” could be a level from The Metal Age; though it’s still somewhat sparse, less dense with objects and texture detail.
This thread is so long now I fear I’m going to start repeating myself. If I do it’s because something influenced me to think about a topic again.
The little inconsistencies indicate there was no single creative vision holder overseeing these levels. That does make the ways in which they are consistent and cohesive all the more impressive. Objective text can range from the terse to the flowery, and the way you’re directed not to kill anything on Expert is always slightly different. Object placement, lighting style, quantity of in-level text objects etc, are all highly variable. Yet that variance is all within a pretty narrow range, like those involved might not all be on exactly the same page but they are all reading the same book.
I feel like I should have more to say about “Song of the Caverns”… It’s a good level if a little staid compared to the two that came before it. Layout reminds me of Bafford’s with its use of linear symmetry.
Looking up designer credits for the various levels and I didn’t realise “Song of the Caverns” was a Terri Brosius (voice of Viktoira and SHODAN) level. Cool.
“Undercover”:
The next level “Undercover” sounds like it’ll be something quite different again.
So “Undercover” promises to be interesting, I guess I have to not hide and instead stroll right in and find the Air Talisman. So I have to infiltrate the Hammer temple to steal the Air Talisman, I’m dressed as a novice which means I can explore most places.
Hmm… So I just got attacked because I was in an area I wasn’t supposed to be in, but I had no idea I wasn’t supposed to be there, and until I stepped over the threshold of that room the Hammers had been ignoring me. Next time I stood in the same place and one Hammer walked right past me, but then two others attacked me. This just feels shitty.
Oh, oh fuck. They will react to literally anything being stolen even if they aren’t watching when I grab it. How the fuck am I going to meet the loot objective for this level? If I steal anything and somebody spots that it’s gone they’ll come for me as I’m the new guy… This is going to be complicated. That I can’t just steal things while nobody is looking makes sense, it just wasn’t behaviour I was expecting from the AI, meaning I now have to restart the level or abandon all pretense of being a Hammer Novice. … I’m torn, I adore this as a concept. But that’s a really bad first impression and it’s hard to not feel like I fucked up because the simulation boundary wasn’t clearly defined.
Just one line by Garrett in the briefing about not taking anything that’d be noticed would have been enough. As it stands many of the actual objectives are about looting and I’m now a little too paranoid to take anything, which I suppose it part of the point.
It’s a rule I don’t think I’d have been aware of without breaking it, which isn’t an instructional method I’m fond of. I don’t think I’ve had an NPC notice missing loot before, it’s certainly not been a cause for them to become alerted. Some of the loot was marked with an inverted red hammer (which it does tell you means off-limits), so I tested it by leaving that loot and stealing from elsewhere. The Hammer still notices. So yeah, it’s a rule that’s never explained until you break it. This has annoyed me… It feels like the game cheated, which is incredibly disappointing. Going to have to take a break.
“Undercover” is the type of level that probably would never have appeared in The Metal Age because it doesn’t quite work. The Metal Age doubled down on those systems that worked most reliably and consistently. Its focus was narrower than it could have been because of that. It lost a lot of the weird edge case concepts which The Dark Project was full of.
Right, that cemetery vase (and presumably other sigillated loot). Firstly, when taken it leaves a marker behind for ~15 seconds. If during that time, an AI sees you within a 15 foot radius of the loot, they will accuse you verbally and alert. – Andy Durdin
I’ve been using the new mantling code added in NewDark (I only thought to check if it was enabled just now). I don’t know what was changed, just that I’ve felt confident in what I can and can’t climb; with a few small exceptions which I’ve complained about previously. I briefly tried to play some of The Metal Age and found I was having trouble traversing low ledges and climbing through first floor windows; turns out I had the new mantling code disabled. So I’m going to leave it enabled.
Back to “Undercover”, taking it slow and not stealing anything that might be noticed, at least not until I inevitably have to make a run for it because I fucked up.
Now this is more like it, every one of those books is a readable object.
Well I’ve found the Air Talisman, now to actually get to it. No Rope Arrows? Garrett that’s just poor planning.
This room looks lovely, can’t imagine anything bad happens in here.
Look, I’m not taking any chances. They’ll all wake up eventually.
Just found another room with a whole bunch of loot piled on the floor; looks like a Hammer storage vault, since I’m here it’d be a shame to leave it all just lying around.
Oh no, actually it’s the new treasury, which was also the old kitchens. That explains the sink in the corner. Notes like this are a masterclass in how to handle in-level readables. It’s short, it provides information relevant to your objectives in a subtle fashion, and its placement and content fit the fiction.
I get the distinct impression these Hammers aren’t exactly nature lovers.
Systemically clearly the bottom two floors, almost at my loot goal already. There’s some social commentary here about the wealth of superficially ascetic religious orders.
Hah… Alright then, this should be interesting. And the kitchen has been moved since this was written, meaning I’ll have to look on the lower level, nice touch.
Took me a while to find where Brother Mason was… Then I think I messed up reciting the Prayer of the Wallbuilder and got scalded (?) by the Air Talisman. Then I grabbed it and all hell broke loose. Fortunately I’d already met the loot objective so just ran.
This is what that previous corridor looked like by the end, at least they weren’t lonely.
That’s “Undercover” done. Beyond some frustrations determining exactly how the rules had changed – given the high concept twist – that was a really strong level.
I’ve always been a fan of the “Casing the Joint”/“Masks” couplet from The Metal Age; however, after playing “Undercover” I have to admit that it’s a much better take on the idea of allowing you to have a planning phase.
Now Garrett has all four Talismans, time to unseal the Hammer Cathedral, grab The Eye and get out. Simple. Then he can retire. I can’t see how anything can possibly go wrong… “Undercover” is another level that makes use of the public/private spatial divide, and again leads to a minor disappointment that the game never explores that fully.
When I talk about the public/private space divide I’m thinking about how the context of a space is rarely relevant. Garrett’s is always noticeable even if he’s in a busy area, guards never just assume he’s a servant because he’s in the servant’s quarters etc. By framing you as a Hammer Novice – therefore limiting the areas you’re allowed to be in – “Undercover” makes the best use of that sense of spatial context yet. Unfortunately it’s still a one-off special case rather than a systemic design element. The only stealth game to really explore that idea of spatial context and the different people allowed in each space is Hitman.
Next: “Return to the Cathedral”